[CESG] FW: [Moims-sc] CCSDS-OMG Liaison: Satellite Command & Control Message Specification (C2MS)
Gian.Paolo.Calzolari at esa.int
Gian.Paolo.Calzolari at esa.int
Mon Oct 22 15:11:37 UTC 2018
Peter,
As Dan is not a member of cesg at mailman.ccsds.org his mail either
remained to be moderated or was automatically discarded.....
My cent.....
Gippo
From: "Shames, Peter M (312B)" <Peter.M.Shames at jpl.nasa.gov>
To: CCSDS Engineering Steering Group - CESG Exec
<cesg at mailman.ccsds.org>
Date: 22-10-18 16:57
Subject: [CESG] FW: [Moims-sc] CCSDS-OMG Liaison: Satellite Command
& Control Message Specification (C2MS)
Sent by: "CESG" <cesg-bounces at mailman.ccsds.org>
Dear CESG colleagues,
You were emailed this on 6 Sept, but it appears to not have been
delivered. I am re-sending it for your information.
Regards, Peter
From: Dan Smith <danford.s.smith at nasa.gov>
Date: Thursday, September 6, 2018 at 10:48 AM
To: Mario Merri <Mario.Merri at esa.int>, Peter Shames
<Peter.M.Shames at jpl.nasa.gov>
Cc: Brigitte Behal <brigitte.behal at cnes.fr>, Erik Barkley
<Erik.J.Barkley at jpl.nasa.gov>, James Afarin <james.afarin at nasa.gov>,
Michael McKay <Michael.McKay at esa.int>, Sam Cooper
<sam at brightascension.com>, CCSDS Engineering Steering Group - CESG Exec
<cesg at mailman.ccsds.org>
Subject: RE: [Moims-sc] CCSDS-OMG Liaison: Satellite Command & Control
Message Specification (C2MS)
Mario,
You note that you did not receive any comments on the TN. That is not a
fair statement.
I sent you my general comment and also let you know that I had prepared a
full response for discussion at the CESG meeting. I gave my full response
to the NASA CESG members and I never got a request from you for a copy.
Instead of holding it for the CESG meeting, I have attached my comments to
this email.
Clearly, there are more unresolved issues that just the two you mention
below.
Dan
=========================
Dan Smith
NASA/GSFC
Code 580
Bldg 23, Room E443
8800 Greenbelt Road
Greenbelt, MD 20771
301-286-2230
Dan.Smith at nasa.gov
Believe the science. There are no “alternative facts”.
From: Mario.Merri at esa.int [mailto:Mario.Merri at esa.int]
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2018 12:49 PM
To: Shames, Peter M (JPL-312B)[Jet Propulsion Laboratory]
<peter.m.shames at jpl.nasa.gov>
Cc: brigitte.behal at cnes.fr; Smith, Danford S. (GSFC-5800)
<danford.s.smith at nasa.gov>; Barkley, Erik J (JPL-3970)[Jet Propulsion
Laboratory] <erik.j.barkley at jpl.nasa.gov>; Afarin, James (HQ-CG000)
<james.afarin at nasa.gov>; Michael.McKay at esa.int; Sam Cooper
<sam at brightascension.com>; cesg at mailman.ccsds.org
Subject: Re: [Moims-sc] CCSDS-OMG Liaison: Satellite Command & Control
Message Specification (C2MS)
Dear Peter,
following yesterday CESG webex and for the sake of clarity, I would like
to report on the conclusions of the discussion on the email below that was
caused by some misunderstanding of yours:
1. It was confirmed that I received an action from the CESG to request the
production of the TN. This is documented in the approved CESG MoM of
Gaithersburg.
2. I have NOT distributed the TN to the OMG, but only to the SM&C WG and
to the CESG requesting comments by 31Aug (no comment received). Margherita
forwarded the TN to the CMC for information.
This clarifies the matter. What is still unresolved are:
1. the non-consensus within the SM&C WG
2. the fact that OMG has ignored the head up for potential overlapping.
The agreed way forward will be reported in the CESG Webex MoM.
Regards,
__Mario
From: "Shames, Peter M (312B)" <Peter.M.Shames at jpl.nasa.gov>
To: "Mario.Merri at esa.int" <Mario.Merri at esa.int>, "Smith, Danford S.
(GSFC-5800)" <danford.s.smith at nasa.gov>
Cc: "brigitte.behal at cnes.fr" <brigitte.behal at cnes.fr>, "Barkley,
Erik J (3970)" <Erik.J.Barkley at jpl.nasa.gov>, "Afarin, James (HQ-CG000)" <
james.afarin at nasa.gov>, Sam Cooper <sam at brightascension.com>, CESG <
cesg-bounces at mailman.ccsds.org>, "Michael.McKay at esa.int" <
Michael.McKay at esa.int>
Date: 04/09/2018 22:02
Subject: Re: [Moims-sc] CCSDS-OMG Liaison: Satellite Command &
Control Message Specification (C2MS)
Dear Mario,
It's strange, but different people seem to have quite different memories
of what happened during that CESG meeting. My notes, written during the
meeting, say this:
Mario raises issue of “overlap” between the SM&C MAL and the new OMG C2MS
(GMSEC), suggests an analysis paper is needed. Discussed in CESG, but no
explicit request for resolution or vote in support. Mario just says “I’m
doing this."
So, according to my notes, and my own recollections, there was no "request
by the CESG" that you do this. Nor was there even a voice vote or raising
of the hands to indicate that the CESG was in agreement. You did not ask
for this, you just announced that you were doing it. This is not behavior
that is consistent with how we normally carry out our business, and I
really must object to you trying to re-write history to suggest otherwise.
The fact that you subsequently went ahead and sent this to the OMG with a
statement that it was a CCSDS position is also behavior that is out of the
norm. There was no CESG nor CCSDS agreement to take this position, this
was your fabrication. If that biased position paper had been submitted to
OMG as an agency, or even multi-agency, position that would be fine. But
describing it as a CCDS position, and proposing that we break our liaison
relationship with OMG because you did not like their handling of this, is
also outside the norm of how we do business.
So in this case I would say that many of the issues having to do with
faults in "nominally agreed processes between CCSDS and OMG for
identifying and openly discussing overlapping standards" must lie at your
doorstep and cannot be blamed on the OMG. Nor is it accurate to state
that this was a result of a CESG request or concensus. It was not.
Regards, Peter
From: Mario Merri <Mario.Merri at esa.int>
Date: Tuesday, September 4, 2018 at 12:32 AM
To: Dan Smith <danford.s.smith at nasa.gov>
Cc: Brigitte Behal <brigitte.behal at cnes.fr>, Erik Barkley <
Erik.J.Barkley at jpl.nasa.gov>, James Afarin <james.afarin at nasa.gov>, Peter
Shames <Peter.M.Shames at jpl.nasa.gov>, Sam Cooper <sam at brightascension.com
>, CESG <cesg-bounces at mailman.ccsds.org>, Michael McKay <
Michael.McKay at esa.int>
Subject: RE: [Moims-sc] CCSDS-OMG Liaison: Satellite Command & Control
Message Specification (C2MS)
Dear Dan,
I recall that this technical note had been requested by the CESG at the
last meeting in Gaithersburg after my presentation of the report prepared
by the SM&C WG that indicated that 3 agencies believed that, after the WG
discussion that took place at the last technical meeting, there is a
substantial overlapping between work of the WG and the C2MS proposal
submission to OMG. This is clearly an indication of non-consensus in the
WG which needs to be explicitly raised to the CESG for resolution. As you
correctly pointed out, any agency can decide to use whatever system they
prefer, but here we are discussing standards and in this occasion the
nominally agreed processes between CCSDS and OMG for identifying and
openly discussing overlapping standards have not worked.
Regards,
__Mario
From: "Smith, Danford S. (GSFC-5800)" <danford.s.smith at nasa.gov>
To: "Mario.Merri at esa.int" <Mario.Merri at esa.int>
Cc: "brigitte.behal at cnes.fr" <brigitte.behal at cnes.fr>, Sam Cooper <
sam at brightascension.com>, "Afarin, James (HQ-CG000)" <
james.afarin at nasa.gov>, "Shames, Peter M (JPL-312B)[Jet Propulsion
Laboratory]" <peter.m.shames at jpl.nasa.gov>, "Barkley, Erik J
(JPL-3970)[Jet Propulsion Laboratory]" <erik.j.barkley at jpl.nasa.gov>,
"Smith, Danford S. (GSFC-5800)" <danford.s.smith at nasa.gov>
Date: 28/08/2018 14:29
Subject: RE: [Moims-sc] CCSDS-OMG Liaison: Satellite Command &
Control Message Specification (C2MS)
Mario,
I think it is important that every space agency ground system group stay
up to date on what is going on in their industry, so I am glad to see that
CNES and DLR have compared MO and C2MS. Other than a courtesy between
agencies, I don’t see why the report needs to be shared within agencies
and clearly, there is no reason we should give it to the OMG. Each
agency can make its own determination of the merits of different
approaches and the validity of claims made in different reports and their
own studies. Although I disagree with how the report was written, its
characterization of capabilities and limitations of different systems, and
the overall tone, it is not my place to critique work performed outside of
the CCSDS WG that I chair unless it is becoming part of a CCSDS position
or will be delivered on behalf of CCSDS – neither of which should occur in
this case. If CNES or DLR or ESA wanted correct or clarifying information
on C2MS or on GMSEC, they could have contacted either the OMG or NASA, and
neither was done. It was not clear that the whitepaper was making any
recommendations regarding the OMG and it is clearly outside of the OMG
policies for submitting comments in a timely manner, so I suggest that the
paper be distributed between agencies at the discretion of the authors and
then the action (if there was one) can be closed.
I have submitted a more technical and process-oriented response to the
NASA CESG members to support discussions on the topic at the next CESG
meeting.
Dan
=========================
Dan Smith
NASA/GSFC
Code 580
Bldg 23, Room E443
8800 Greenbelt Road
Greenbelt, MD 20771
301-286-2230
Dan.Smith at nasa.gov
Believe the science. There are no “alternative facts”.
From: MOIMS-SC [mailto:moims-sc-bounces at mailman.ccsds.org] On Behalf Of
Mario.Merri at esa.int
Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2018 3:56 AM
To: moims-sc at mailman.ccsds.org
Subject: [Moims-sc] CCSDS-OMG Liaison: Satellite Command & Control Message
Specification (C2MS)
Dear SM&C WG,
As per CESG Action Item from the Gaithersburg meeting, please find
enclosed the Technical Note describing the overlap between the CCSDS MO
Services and the OMG (proposed) C2MS. The TN has been produced by the
active members of the SM&C WG (except for NASA) under DLR leadership and
it is fully supported by CNES and ESA. The TN has been distributed to the
CESG. Since it relates to the SM&C WG, we would like to share it also with
the WG. Please provide any comment you may have before 31Aug18.
Best regards,
Brigitte & Mario
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DSMITH.docx" deleted by Gian Paolo Calzolari/esoc/ESA]
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