[SIS-MIA] Summary SIS-MIVA Meeting Fall 2025 - Hamburg

Wed Sep 17 10:00:00 EDT 2025

Hi Falk,

Some comments below inline, also in view of the forthcoming preparation of
the MIVA slides for the CESG next week:

From: SIS-MIA <sis-mia-bounces at mailman.ccsds.org> On Behalf Of
Falk.Schiffner--- via SIS-MIA
Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2025 2:40 PM
To: sis-mia at mailman.ccsds.org
Subject: [SIS-MIA] Summary SIS-MIVA Meeting Fall 2025 - Hamburg

Hello Everybody,
Thanks to everyone, that either took the long travel to be here or got up
early to join remotely. We covered a lot of ground in just 2 days, with a
clear outcome where the group is heading!

This Email is supposed to update everybody that wasn't able to join, and
further to keep track, so that no task will be forgotten. Please, feel free
to reply and add things I may forgot to put in here, or extent some point if
you feel it is necessary. 

1.	RTPoverDTN: 

- The project is almost over the finish line. The content of the Blue and
Yellow Book is completed, only I minor issue came up, that we need to add
the credits for test video used (screen shot of it in the YB), Walt will
check that.

- The Yellow Book still need to "GO" from NASAs export control. (Vinni
suggested that this should be done by the end of the week). Afterwards we
are ready to hand-in the books. 

[TdC] I remember that when Rodney was still the WG chair he reminded that
the revision work following the unsuccessful CESG poll (more than two years
ago) would have resulted in some substantial changes in the specification,
i.e. a new agency review needed before targeting again a new CESG poll. Can
you please confirm/clarify?

2.	Video Quality:
- Video Recordings: 

- 5 scenes needs to be shot. Walt and Jacob will coordinate that, then to
all reference scenes are shot, need to down select to approx. 10 files
representing all the different use cases (open until all files are
recorded).

- Checking  the legal terms / licenses / disclaimer we need to put online
together with the video files (terms of use) (NASA-Jeremy)

- Asking to IT department of CCSDS, how the file upload and update process
will be (Falk)

- We need to keep the degradation as constant as possible in the video
sequence to obtain meaningful quality scores (instrumental and subjective),
further this will also help to distribute the quality ratings over the whole
range of the quality scale (Walt and Jacob will tweak the encoder settings
to do so)

- To avoid bias by using the terms (poor, bad, fair) common in quality
testing, we will implement something like "SVQL" (SpaceVideoQualityLevel
1-6). Nevertheless the connection between these levels the corresponding
VMAF quality scores, the subjective ratings and the original terms will be
made in the Yellow Book, to be in line with the vast applications and
standards from other bodies like ITU, ETSI etc.

- Green Book on VQ is not published yet and did not make it to the tech.
editor list, when transitioning to the new editor team, need to hand-in the
book again (Falk)

[TdC] I'll raise the point of the long editor queue at the CESG, it's
becoming insane.

- Subjective Video Quality Test:

               - Information on conducting subjective video quality tests
need to be provided to the group, instructions, testtool, examples (Falk)

- Open Discussion on the usage of "AI" for enhancing or manipulating video.

               - Eg. for reduction of bandwidth needs, error correction etc.

               - in the moment there is no Req. from an Agency or Program
that would drive the need for a standard on this topic

               - Nevertheless, because AI will become more and more
influential in all kind of domains, CCSDS needs to be aware, that maybe a
Standard is needed in the future.   

[TdC] not clear to me whether this is going to be conveyed in the magenta
book you wanted to develop or a new path is going to be taken here. If the
former, maybe it is the time to create the project. If not, we should
argument what we want to do, since in the previous reporting in Spring (and
also in Fall'24) we somehow stated that there was the idea to go for a
magenta.

3.	VOICE:
- Green and Blue Book: Both Books are still relevant and should be reviewed
an updated if necessary.
- Planned the review of the Books.  
- Fred and Falk going through the documents with comments and additional
info, Walt will put everything together. 
- There are no topics currently that will drive a new project in the moment

[TdC] I understand that a check is still to be done on the VOICE books. As
such any necessary projects will be created later on. Please remember that
in the case of small corrections (i.e. corrigendum), we don't need any
projects and we can just prepare the corrigenda and send to CESG for
approval.

4.	Two Online-Meetings are foreseen until the next in-person meeting in
Spring '26 (Currently only a rough date is announced - mid to end of
March?!)
- first should be scheduled in early Dec25

- second should be scheduled in late Jan26 

So, I hope I summarized everything, and did not forgot to much! As said,
really fruitful meeting, Again Thanks a lot and see you soon!
Best Falk

---------------------------------------

German Aerospace Center (DLR e.V.)

Space Operations & Astronaut Training | Communication & Ground Stations

Rutherfordstrasse 2 | 12489 Berlin

Dr.-Ing.  F a l k   R.   S c h i f f n e r

Ground Operations Group

System Engineer DTN / CCSDS Delegate (DTN, Audio-Video Assessment) 

Telefon: +49 (0)30 670558177 | Email: falk.schiffner at dlr.de
<mailto:falk.schiffner at dlr.de> 

 <http://www.dlr.de/> www.DLR.de 

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