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<p class="MsoNormal">Hello Felix!<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><u>THANKS!!</u></b> One of our goals in using the protocol is to of course to be compatible with other implementations, so if yours implements it in that way we should follow suit.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">As for the changes to the pink sheets I would actually recommend making it even more explicit…<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">“One or more … messages may be optionally included and <span style="color:red">
the value of each TLV </span>shall be constructed as indicated in…”<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Or perhaps even more useful would be class diagram added as an appendix to help understand the relations between the different constructs :<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><img width="2113" height="460" style="width:22.0104in;height:4.7916in" id="Picture_x0020_7" src="cid:image007.png@01D94DCB.B159EA20"><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Unfortunately as written you need to read a lot of that document to understand the relations between things, I know having the roadmap above would’ve helped me a lot if I had it. Please let me know if some part of the above diagram doesn’t
mesh with the intent as I’m still trying to grasp all of the interactions between things in the Blue Book.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks again!<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Segoe Script";color:#1F497D">Andy Willms<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Barlow;color:#1F497D">AERS SW Applications Engineer III<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Barlow;color:#1F497D">Blue Origin -</span></b><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Barlow">
<span style="color:#1F497D">Orbital Launch Site</span></span></b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Barlow;color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Barlow;color:#1F497D">8082 Space Commerce Way<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Barlow;color:#1F497D">Merritt Island, FL 32953
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Barlow;color:#1F497D">(C): 716-213-8502<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Felix Flentge <Felix.Flentge@esa.int> <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 3, 2023 5:06 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Andy Willms <AWillms@blueorigin.com>; sis-cfdpv1@mailman.ccsds.org; dstanton@keltik.co.uk<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Sergey Savelyev <ssavelyev@blueorigin.com><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: Blue Origin -- CFDP Question<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<b><span style="color:#212121">[EXTERNAL]</span></b><span style="color:#212121"> </span>
<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Dear Andy,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">I am always happy to see more people using the standard (and actually using features I have not seen being used in operations: SFO I would hope to see replaced by CFDP over Bundle Protocol in the future and proxy operations
are typically replaced by mission/agency specific commanding outside CFDP).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Regarding your question, my interpretation (and implementation) is that ‘one or more’ means ‘one or more TVL’ and not ‘multiple messages in a single TVL’ (slightly less efficient but much easier to parse).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">(The Green Book is not normative and may contain some mistakes.)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">So, if nobody objects, we should clarify this in the upcoming pink sheets to the standard. Would the formulation
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:TimesNewRomanPSMT">One or more … messages may be optionally included and<b><span style="color:red"> each
</span></b>shall be constructed as indicated in …</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">be clear enough?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Felix<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><b>From:</b> Andy Willms <<a href="mailto:AWillms@blueorigin.com">AWillms@blueorigin.com</a>>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 28 February 2023 20:44<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:sis-cfdpv1@mailman.ccsds.org">sis-cfdpv1@mailman.ccsds.org</a>; Felix Flentge <<a href="mailto:Felix.Flentge@esa.int">Felix.Flentge@esa.int</a>>;
<a href="mailto:dstanton@keltik.co.uk">dstanton@keltik.co.uk</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Sergey Savelyev <<a href="mailto:ssavelyev@blueorigin.com">ssavelyev@blueorigin.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Blue Origin -- CFDP Question<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Greetings!<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">While reading <span lang="EN-GB"><a href="https://urldefense.us/v3/__https:/eur05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https*3A*2F*2Fpublic.ccsds.org*2FPubs*2F727x0b5.pdf&data=05*7C01*7CFelix.Flentge*40esa.int*7Cce5078e443f340ead37e08db19c43ea1*7C9a5cacd02bef4dd7ac5c7ebe1f54f495*7C0*7C0*7C638132102886083693*7CUnknown*7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0*3D*7C3000*7C*7C*7C&sdata=Z1*2FETNTTl7c2pAv8fQAK50d9PkaffpdtC6g8jUETcfg*3D&reserved=0__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJQ!!OvyHrJTNo7faK-qlAog!J4ScHDPNlA7oi9Qz4uX1n33XPyD77IZR9s4quOU5hswtjX3q5DUdNZ-eSbNiEV30Iu7FQmIeKInBpVK1H5pNDqmOug$" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:#212529">CCSDS
727.0-B-5</span></a></span> and <span lang="EN-GB"><a href="https://urldefense.us/v3/__https:/eur05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https*3A*2F*2Fpublic.ccsds.org*2FPubs*2F720x2g4.pdf&data=05*7C01*7CFelix.Flentge*40esa.int*7Cce5078e443f340ead37e08db19c43ea1*7C9a5cacd02bef4dd7ac5c7ebe1f54f495*7C0*7C0*7C638132102886083693*7CUnknown*7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0*3D*7C3000*7C*7C*7C&sdata=2KNxfB74ZEn9v1jglzzF61*2BAuJ903JcKOpVwiAxDXkw*3D&reserved=0__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJQ!!OvyHrJTNo7faK-qlAog!J4ScHDPNlA7oi9Qz4uX1n33XPyD77IZR9s4quOU5hswtjX3q5DUdNZ-eSbNiEV30Iu7FQmIeKInBpVK1H5qe_BpzZg$" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:#212529">CCSDS
720.2-G-4</span></a></span> I noticed what might be a typo/ambiguity in the document(s) and was hoping to get some clarification.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Based on section 3.7.2 in the green book a SFO Message to User can contain multiple ‘Msgs to User’. That is to say, a single user message TLV can contain one or more reserved user messages. The blue book seems to
convey this behavior in section B.2.4.3 with the wording “One or more SFO Messages to User may be optionally included…”:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><img border="0" width="448" height="369" style="width:4.6666in;height:3.8437in" id="Picture_x0020_2" src="cid:image001.png@01D94DC2.DBD0D1F0"><img border="0" width="1102" height="370" style="width:11.4791in;height:3.8541in" id="Picture_x0020_3" src="cid:image002.png@01D94DC2.DBD0D1F0"><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">On the other hand ‘Proxy Message to User’ does not seem to indicate that in section 3.2.2 of the green book, but the same wordage is used in section
<a href="https://urldefense.us/v3/__http:/6.2.3.3__;!!OvyHrJTNo7faK-qlAog!J4ScHDPNlA7oi9Qz4uX1n33XPyD77IZR9s4quOU5hswtjX3q5DUdNZ-eSbNiEV30Iu7FQmIeKInBpVK1H5oPUPsEnA$">
6.2.3.3</a> of the blue book:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><img border="0" width="490" height="397" style="width:5.1041in;height:4.1354in" id="Picture_x0020_4" src="cid:image003.png@01D94DC2.DBD0D1F0"><img border="0" width="1076" height="385" style="width:11.2083in;height:4.0104in" id="Picture_x0020_5" src="cid:image004.png@01D94DC2.DBD0D1F0"><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><b><u>Which leads to my question, is the wording “one or more” for the following sections in the blue book describing the existence of one or more TLVs in a given PDU or the existence of one or more reserved messages
in that single TLV?<o:p></o:p></u></b></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:1.0in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>Section <a href="https://urldefense.us/v3/__http:/6.2.3.3__;!!OvyHrJTNo7faK-qlAog!J4ScHDPNlA7oi9Qz4uX1n33XPyD77IZR9s4quOU5hswtjX3q5DUdNZ-eSbNiEV30Iu7FQmIeKInBpVK1H5oPUPsEnA$">
6.2.3.3</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:1.0in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>Section <a href="https://urldefense.us/v3/__http:/6.2.3.4__;!!OvyHrJTNo7faK-qlAog!J4ScHDPNlA7oi9Qz4uX1n33XPyD77IZR9s4quOU5hswtjX3q5DUdNZ-eSbNiEV30Iu7FQmIeKInBpVK1H5qxUudADA$">
6.2.3.4</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:1.0in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>Section <a href="https://urldefense.us/v3/__http:/6.2.3.5__;!!OvyHrJTNo7faK-qlAog!J4ScHDPNlA7oi9Qz4uX1n33XPyD77IZR9s4quOU5hswtjX3q5DUdNZ-eSbNiEV30Iu7FQmIeKInBpVK1H5p9CmCDBg$">
6.2.3.5</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:1.0in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>Section <a href="https://urldefense.us/v3/__http:/6.2.5.3__;!!OvyHrJTNo7faK-qlAog!J4ScHDPNlA7oi9Qz4uX1n33XPyD77IZR9s4quOU5hswtjX3q5DUdNZ-eSbNiEV30Iu7FQmIeKInBpVK1H5p40HR3UA$">
6.2.5.3</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:1.0in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>Section B2.4.3<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:1.0in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>Section B2.4.4<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:1.0in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]>Section B2.4.5<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Perhaps asked another way, assuming I wanted to set 3 fault handler overrides could that be done with the following structure<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><img border="0" width="1200" height="318" style="width:12.5in;height:3.3125in" id="Picture_x0020_1" src="cid:image005.png@01D94DC2.DBD0D1F0"><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Or would I need to send three separate TLVs to affect the desired behavior?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><img border="0" width="915" height="926" style="width:9.5312in;height:9.6458in" id="Picture_x0020_6" src="cid:image006.png@01D94DC2.DBD0D1F0"><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Thank you for any help you can provide!!<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Segoe Script";color:#1F497D">Andy Willms<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Barlow;color:#1F497D">AERS SW Applications Engineer III<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Barlow;color:#1F497D">Blue Origin -</span></b><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Barlow">
<span style="color:#1F497D">Orbital Launch Site</span></span></b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Barlow;color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Barlow;color:#1F497D">8082 Space Commerce Way<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Barlow;color:#1F497D">Merritt Island, FL 32953
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Barlow;color:#1F497D">(C): 716-213-8502<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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