<html xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8">
<meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)">
<style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Tahoma;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:#0563C1;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:#954F72;
text-decoration:underline;}
p.MsoListParagraph, li.MsoListParagraph, div.MsoListParagraph
{mso-style-priority:34;
margin-top:0in;
margin-right:0in;
margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:.5in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}
p.msonormal0, li.msonormal0, div.msonormal0
{mso-style-name:msonormal;
mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
margin-right:0in;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
margin-left:0in;
font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}
span.EmailStyle19
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle20
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
color:#1F497D;}
span.EmailStyle21
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle22
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle23
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle24
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
color:windowtext;}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
font-size:10.0pt;}
@page WordSection1
{size:8.5in 11.0in;
margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
/* List Definitions */
@list l0
{mso-list-id:87701445;
mso-list-template-ids:-1842066844;}
@list l0:level1
{mso-level-tab-stop:.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l0:level2
{mso-level-tab-stop:1.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l0:level3
{mso-level-tab-stop:1.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l0:level4
{mso-level-tab-stop:2.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l0:level5
{mso-level-tab-stop:2.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l0:level6
{mso-level-tab-stop:3.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l0:level7
{mso-level-tab-stop:3.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l0:level8
{mso-level-tab-stop:4.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l0:level9
{mso-level-tab-stop:4.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
ol
{margin-bottom:0in;}
ul
{margin-bottom:0in;}
--></style>
</head>
<body lang="EN-US" link="#0563C1" vlink="#954F72">
<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Ok. Great.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Thanks, Peter<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><b><span style="color:black">From: </span>
</b><span style="color:black">Ramon Krosley <r.krosley@andropogon.org><br>
<b>Date: </b>Wednesday, June 27, 2018 at 9:03 AM<br>
<b>To: </b>Peter Shames <peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov>, Roger Thompson <roger.rocketbrain@btinternet.com><br>
<b>Cc: </b>SEA-SA <sea-sa@mailman.ccsds.org><br>
<b>Subject: </b>RE: Feedback on the current ASL GB Draft<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">It is based on the copy that you sent to me via email most recently. So that should be everything that you provided.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> Shames, Peter M (312B) <peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, June 27, 2018 10:02 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> ramon krosley <r.krosley@andropogon.org>; 'Roger Thompson' <roger.rocketbrain@btinternet.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> 'SEA-SA' <sea-sa@mailman.ccsds.org><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Feedback on the current ASL GB Draft</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Hi Ray,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Does that version include the stuff I provided too?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Thanks, Peter</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><b><span style="color:black">From:
</span></b><span style="color:black">Ramon Krosley <<a href="mailto:r.krosley@andropogon.org">r.krosley@andropogon.org</a>><br>
<b>Date: </b>Wednesday, June 27, 2018 at 8:59 AM<br>
<b>To: </b>Roger Thompson <<a href="mailto:roger.rocketbrain@btinternet.com">roger.rocketbrain@btinternet.com</a>>, Peter Shames <<a href="mailto:peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov">peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov</a>><br>
<b>Cc: </b>SEA-SA <<a href="mailto:sea-sa@mailman.ccsds.org">sea-sa@mailman.ccsds.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject: </b>RE: Feedback on the current ASL GB Draft</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Hi Roger,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">It’s Draft E on CWE. I’m currently not editing it, but expect to do so later today, probably after you close up shop this evening. Please let me know when you are done editing,
and I’ll work on the new version that you put on CWE. Thanks!</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Ramon</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> Roger Thompson <<a href="mailto:roger.rocketbrain@btinternet.com">roger.rocketbrain@btinternet.com</a>>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, June 27, 2018 9:46 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'Shames, Peter M (312B)' <<a href="mailto:peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov">peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov</a>>; 'Ramon Krosley' <<a href="mailto:r.krosley@andropogon.org">r.krosley@andropogon.org</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> 'SEA-SA' <<a href="mailto:sea-sa@mailman.ccsds.org">sea-sa@mailman.ccsds.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: Feedback on the current ASL GB Draft</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Hi Peter (and Ray),</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">I got back from Ireland a week ago, but spent last week on MPS WG activities, so only just now catching up on your comments.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Some initial responses embedded below.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">I am updating my Implementation View diagrams in the light of our discussions at the last telecon. Pity I didn’t write down my understanding at the time
– I’m not so clear on what we agreed now!</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">What is the latest version of the GB in case I get around to making updates to it before next week?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Cheers,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Roger</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"> Shames, Peter M (312B) [<a href="mailto:peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov">mailto:peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 04 June 2018 21:32<br>
<b>To:</b> Roger Thompson; Ramon Krosley<br>
<b>Cc:</b> SEA-SA<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Feedback on the current ASL GB Draft<br>
<b>Importance:</b> High</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span lang="EN-GB"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Hi Guys,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Over the last few days I have been reading through the current (or latest) ASL GB draft. I think that you guys have made great progress and this document is coming together rather
nicely. At this point I am up to page 61, the end of Section 4, or something like 1/3 of the way done.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">In the attached version you will see my mark-up notes. There are a lot of inputs that are simply editorial, and others that are somewhat more substantive. In the "substantive" column
I would put the following:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Most of what is now in Sec 1.1 really, IMHO, belongs in Sec 1.3, Rationale. This is the expected usage in CCSDS Green Books, but they have been known to vary.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><b><i><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">[RST] I agree that it covers the Rationale – but then what should go in Purpose? Also, what we now have in Scope needs this “rationale” to explain it (and therefore
to precede it). I would prefer to leave as is and delete the Rationale section, or to change the title to Purpose and Rationale.</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="mso-list:Ignore">2.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt">The MOIMS sections that I have reviewed so far. are very good and quite complete. In fact, they almost seem too complete, but that is another discussion. If everything is done to this level, as it should
be to have an "even" appearance, the doc will be huge.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><b><i><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">[RST] We aim to please. I have tried to keep it terse where possible. I’m not so sure that the SOIS sections will be as extensive as the MOIMS – as MOIMS covers
many individual interactions, whilst SOIS is really one big concept.</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="mso-list:Ignore">3.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt">The handling of the interfaces between MOIMS and CSS does not strike me as satisfactory. The MOIMS MO services must plan for space links, send data over space links, and get data of various kinds from
space links. It just does not seem acceptable to say "</span> <span style="font-size:11.0pt">
telemetry acquisition and telecommand uplink are communications layer functions that do not directly interact at the application layer with MOIMS functions ". If not MOIMS, then where? Is there an air gap? Does some other CCSDS area have responsibility?
In SCCS-ADD parlance it is "applications" that interact with the SLE and CSTS services. Those application, IMHO, ought to be MOIMS.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><b><i><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">[RST] I believe what is shown for these interfaces is both correct and complete – I don’t see why it is not satisfactory. You are correct that at the application
level, there is planning – but it is not “MO Services” that do this planning (they are effectively just an interface). It is Mission Planning and Mission Control applications themselves that do the planning and related mission control functions – these functions
are shown as interacting with the relevant CSS services for Service Management, M&C, etc. (where these are themselves Application Level Services, but following the “London Agreement” the planning of CSS Service provision is outside the scope of MOIMS. That
Planning function is assumed to be within the scope of the external TT&C function. We have other external ground segment functions that are outside the scope of MOIMS: not least the Mission Data Processing, so this is not unique. I personally may have some
sympathy with the view that application level functions associated with Mission Control should be considered within the MOIMS domain – but this is not the current CCSDS position. End-to-end MO Services that use the SLE Transfer Services do so as a protocol
layer, which is shown in the Communications Viewpoint. Any MO Service deployed in a Space Link Context may use the SLE Transfer Services. What we could do is find somewhere to add a section to explain the relationship between MOIMS and CSS – although this
could highlight some irrationality.</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="mso-list:Ignore">4.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt">The SOIS materials, by contrast, are good, but seem really incomplete. Notwithstanding that the scope of SOIS is considerably less than that of MOIMS, the treatment of the SOIS functions and services is
itself truncated in the extreme. As much as MOIMS seems a little overblown, SOIS seems totally underinflated. I think we need to seek parallel construction in each of the sections wherever possible. See in particular my comments in Sec 2.4.2 and 4.3.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="mso-list:Ignore">5.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Some of the SOIS limitations are due to the "silverizing" activity that occurred, some of it seems due to a shift in focus by the leadership to implementation approaches and EDS. Regardless, those SOIS
functions and features (support, subnet, wireless) that remain in MB and GB materials really should be adequately covered in this document.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="mso-list:Ignore">6.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt">I like the materials in Sec 3.3, but worry a little that we may be putting too much "RASDS 2.0" materials into this document. There may not really be much choice, because we have agreed to use these extensions
and really must explain what we are doing and why, but it is a little concern.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><b><i><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">[RST] I think we have to explain the representation used somewhere, and there won’t be a RASDS 2.0 book before this GB is published (I hope).</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="mso-list:Ignore">7.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt">The distinctions in type and representation that are used in Sec 3.3 among unspecified, published, under development, proposed, and "no standard identified" seem, in general, to be not sufficiently distinct
to be useful. I think the important distinction is really only between "do we have a standard" and "do we have any sort of plan for a standard". Everything else is just so much idle speculation. Three levels are probably enough: "it exists", "we have a
plan for it", and "something could be (might be) here, but isn’t".</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><b><i><span style="font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">[RST] I could possibly live with that – but do not have the budget to change all the diagrams yet again (as I said when I undertook the last change). It is relatively
minor whether we split the “we have a plan for it” into “ we are working on it” and “it’s on the roadmap” – which is effectively what we have. I do not think it would be a good use of resources to make any change here.</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">I'll keep on plugging away at this. Do take a look and see if what I have identified seems reasonable or really off base.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Thanks, Peter</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:1.0in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</body>
</html>