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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Thank you Peter. Let me also have the chance to write down my understanding and preliminary conclusions from yesterday meeting.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Indeed, we could not go through each individual point in depth and your claims could not be challenged conclusively, however, following your presentation,
below is a summary of the main faults that you reported:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<ol style="margin-top:0cm" start="1" type="1">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Blue vs Magenta / Abstract vs Concrete<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Security<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Undefined terms<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Missing references<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Vague Definitions<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">PICS<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">My take on the points above:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<ol style="margin-top:0cm" start="1" type="1">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo2"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">The MAL is the chartered approach approved by CESG/CMC and should not be rediscussed every
time. This needs to be accepted by everyone in CCSDS and put forward to potential customers as for any other CCSDS standards.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo2"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Extensive discussion and way forward agreements are already in place with the SEC WG, which
includes the update of other documents (i.e. RM and GB). It would be inefficient and wrong to have every details repeated everywhere. Having said this, if clarification could be introduced in MAL this should be done.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo2"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">To be discussed with WG. Clearly clarity is important, however I regard this point as editorial<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo2"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">To be discussed with WG. I regard this point as editorial<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo2"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">To be discussed with WG as probably there are misunderstandings. Certainly, this matter has
not changed from the published version of MAL. <o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo2"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Usefulness of PICS in the context of a framework such as MAL is debatable: in fact all features
are “mandatory” here, while some may be made “optional” when implementing a specific service (e.g. in M&C service).
<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">My overall comment is that there was an overreaction for this book and the above issues could have been easily fixed during the Agency Review as done
for most of the other CCSDS books. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Best regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">__Mario<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> CESG <cesg-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Shames, Peter M (US 312B) via CESG<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 18 July 2022 23:44<br>
<b>To:</b> cesg@mailman.ccsds.org<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Tom Gannett <thomas.gannett@tgannett.net>; Reeves, Scott (MSFC-HP27)[HOSC SERVICES CONTRACT] <scott.reeves@nasa.gov>; Mehran Sarkarati <Mehran.Sarkarati@esa.int><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [CESG] CESG Special topic: 2022-7 CESG MAL RID Disposition, was Re: MAL PIDs spreadsheet<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Dear All,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">In order to provide a complete record of this topic in one place I just updated the CESG folder for the “</span><a href="https://eur05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcwe.ccsds.org%2Fcesg%2Fdocs%2FForms%2FAllItems.aspx%3FRootFolder%3D%252Fcesg%252Fdocs%252FCWE%2520Private%252FMeetings%252F2022-7%2520CESG%2520MAL%2520RID%2520Disposition%26FolderCTID%3D0x0120008F128D83E4774A40906DD60662AC3B27%26View%3D%257B448728FC-9186-4BCF-80F0-192B39C01942%257D&data=05%7C01%7CMario.Merri%40esa.int%7Cf0f25279775f45f774f808da6906b160%7C9a5cacd02bef4dd7ac5c7ebe1f54f495%7C0%7C0%7C637937774720068057%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=l00N24A%2F7vAtwP1fZvWbaviXFsThLa8Nc00Cix0pGDs%3D&reserved=0" title="2022-7 CESG MAL RID Disposition"><span lang="EN-US" style="text-decoration:none">2022-7
CESG MAL RID Disposition</span></a><span lang="EN-US">”:<b><o:p></o:p></b></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://eur05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcwe.ccsds.org%2Fcesg%2Fdocs%2FForms%2FAllItems.aspx%3FRootFolder%3D%252Fcesg%252Fdocs%252FCWE%2520Private%252FMeetings%252F2022-7%2520CESG%2520MAL%2520RID%2520Disposition%26FolderCTID%3D0x0120008F128D83E4774A40906DD60662AC3B27%26View%3D%257B448728FC-9186-4BCF-80F0-192B39C01942%257D&data=05%7C01%7CMario.Merri%40esa.int%7Cf0f25279775f45f774f808da6906b160%7C9a5cacd02bef4dd7ac5c7ebe1f54f495%7C0%7C0%7C637937774720068057%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=l00N24A%2F7vAtwP1fZvWbaviXFsThLa8Nc00Cix0pGDs%3D&reserved=0"><span lang="EN-US">https://cwe.ccsds.org/cesg/docs/Forms/AllItems.aspx?RootFolder=%2Fcesg%2Fdocs%2FCWE%20Private%2FMeetings%2F2022%2D7%20CESG%20MAL%20RID%20Disposition&FolderCTID=0x0120008F128D83E4774A40906DD60662AC3B27&View=%7B448728FC%2D9186%2D4BCF%2D80F0%2D192B39C01942%7D</span></a><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">It now contains all of the materials I have provided including the PPT and XLS that were presented today, and also, for the record, a copy of the original CESG vote, the marked up document I returned to the SM&C WG, and
a copy of the email trail leading to today’s Special Topic telecon.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">We could, if it were useful, also add copies of the other CCSDS Blue Books to which I compared the MAL BB in that Analysis document. These are:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<ol style="margin-top:0cm" start="1" type="1">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo3"><span lang="EN-US">CSS CSTS Framework PDU (CCSDS 921.1-B-2)<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo3"><span lang="EN-US">SIS AMS message standard (CCSDS 735.1-B-1)<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo3"><span lang="EN-US">SLS Prox-1 link layer standard (CCSDS 211.0-B-6)<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">These should be useful for the SM&C WG to see what a cross area sampling of other normative CCSDS Blue Books look like. Do let me know if there is anything else I need to provide.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Very best regards, Peter<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">From:
</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Peter Shames <</span><a href="mailto:peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov</span></a><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">><br>
<b>Date: </b>Monday, July 18, 2022 at 1:46 PM<br>
<b>To: </b>Erik Barkley <</span><a href="mailto:erik.j.barkley@jpl.nasa.gov"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">erik.j.barkley@jpl.nasa.gov</span></a><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">><br>
<b>Cc: </b>CESG <</span><a href="mailto:cesg@mailman.ccsds.org"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">cesg@mailman.ccsds.org</span></a><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: MAL PIDs spreadsheet <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Dear Erik, at al,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Thanks for the reminder to provide the SM&C WG PID response spreadsheet, along with my rejoinders, as reviewed. I think you will find that the PPT file, “SEA MO MAL document analysis 11Jul22” accurately summarizes the
intent of my original PIDs. There are some “further clarifications”, I added in lines 25-29 of this spreadsheet after reviewing the PIDs and responses. These are highly relevant, but did not appear in the original for reasons that I think will be clear.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Related to that, there was one additional discussion topic that briefly shows up on pg 15 of the PPT, that of the PICS pro forma, but it only gets a bullet and not a separate page. I remind you that during the meeting
we did compare the one page “PICS” in the MAL BB with parts of the comparable section in the CSS CSTS Framework, 921x1b2. I think the differences in the level of care and detail is informative.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">I will acknowledge, as Mehran pointed out, that many of my comments in the original text were formed as questions. These questions were intended to get the SM&C WG to think carefully about the issues that were being
raised because they were, almost uniformly, issues and concerns that could not be repaired with any simple “From: => To:” formulation. In my judgement that form of input is only really suitable for simple editorial repairs to a sentence or a paragraph.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">These issues are much broader and more pervasive than that, and I hope that has now been made crystal clear.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Lastly, I wish to state with clarity what I think we all agreed to:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<ol style="margin-top:0cm" start="1" type="1">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo4"><span lang="EN-US">That all of the members of the CESG who did not vote in the formal poll, or who voted “Approve Unconditionally”, but then added comments to the effect that they
agreed with my inputs, agreed to do the following: <o:p></o:p></span></li><ol style="margin-top:0cm" start="1" type="a">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo4"><span lang="EN-US">Review the submitted PIDs, the WG dispositions, and my rejoinders in the attached Excel file.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo4"><span lang="EN-US">Review the summary analysis PPT file, “SEA MO MAL document analysis 11Jul22”, as presented.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo4"><span lang="EN-US">Assess whether the statements made in this analysis are accurate when compared to the cited sections and text in the MAL BB.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo4"><span lang="EN-US">Provide written feedback on their assessment of this analysis and the PIDs, preferably with some of their own supporting analysis and detail.<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo4"><span lang="EN-US">That the MOIMS SM&C WG review all of these inputs, both from me and from these other Area Directors, and provide, after suitable discussion, their responses, including:
<o:p></o:p></span></li><ol style="margin-top:0cm" start="1" type="a">
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo4"><span lang="EN-US">Re-assessment of their PID responses in light of these discussions.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo4"><span lang="EN-US">Assessment of the written inputs from the other Area Directors.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l1 level2 lfo4"><span lang="EN-US">Propose their approach for remedying these issues, either by editing the document so that it remedies the issues and aligns with CCSDS Blue Book publication standards,
and CCSDS BB document norms, or by agreeing to reformat it as a normative, Magenta Book, “foundational” abstract reference model.<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo4"><span lang="EN-US">That I, and preferably the other CESG Area Directors, meet with the SM&C WG to review this feedback and resolve any remaining issues.<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">IIn fact, I think that this is a significant enough concern that it would be ideal if all CESG members, including those who voted “Approve Unconditionally”, would participate in this process as well. Only in this way
can we assess if there really is consensus on the path forward.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">I am willing to commit to this.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">For the sake of all concerned, including the WG, the Area, the CESG, our member agencies, and all of our users I think it would be best to get these issues resolved.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Best regards, Peter<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">From:
</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Erik Barkley <</span><a href="mailto:erik.j.barkley@jpl.nasa.gov"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">erik.j.barkley@jpl.nasa.gov</span></a><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">><br>
<b>Date: </b>Monday, July 18, 2022 at 12:24 PM<br>
<b>To: </b>Peter Shames <</span><a href="mailto:peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov</span></a><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">><br>
<b>Cc: </b>CESG <</span><a href="mailto:cesg@mailman.ccsds.org"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">cesg@mailman.ccsds.org</span></a><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">><br>
<b>Subject: </b>MAL PIDs spreadsheet <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Georgia",serif">Hello Peter,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Georgia",serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Georgia",serif">As you may recall, I volunteered to take a look at the MO MAL Agency Review CESG Poll PIDs and check them against the latest MAL document. I see the presentation, dated July 11 in
the CWE for CESG, but I do not find the spreadsheet there. Can you please either send or (probably better) post the spreadsheet? Thank you.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Georgia",serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Georgia",serif">Best regards,
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Georgia",serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia",serif">Erik Barkley<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia",serif">Cross Support Services Area Director<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia",serif">Consultative Committee for Space Data Systems<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://eur05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ccsds.org%2F&data=05%7C01%7CMario.Merri%40esa.int%7Cf0f25279775f45f774f808da6906b160%7C9a5cacd02bef4dd7ac5c7ebe1f54f495%7C0%7C0%7C637937774720068057%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=kKguUyOZW%2FAj%2BgBVSreo4MhT%2BHzAcPhOgIE4SXl8C7s%3D&reserved=0"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia",serif">www.ccsds.org</span></a><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia",serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia",serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Georgia",serif">+1 818.393.4972<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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