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<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="EmailStyle22">Thanks Margherita,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="EmailStyle22">I do want to point out that there are many places, besides Security, where we use ISO definitions.  One of the most commonly cited references when talking of protocols is ISO/IEC 7498, otherwise known as the "Open
 Systems </span>Interconnection - Basic Reference Model (BRM)<b> </b><span class="EmailStyle22">".  Most of SLS, a lot of SIS, and SEA all reference this seven layer model.  In fact, I think CSS, MOIMS, and SOIS do as well.  A lot of the terminology that we
 use, relating to protocols, layers, interfaces, PDU, SDU, etc, is sourced directly from the ISO BRM.   There are other ISO standards that are not as widely used, but which have been referenced, and the definitions used, either directly or with adaptations,
 in CCSDS standards.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="EmailStyle22"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="EmailStyle22">To my knowledge this has never come up as an issue before.  We have always believed that this fell in the context of "fair use".  See
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use</a> for an exact description.  This is, as far as I can tell, US (and UK) practice, but it may not be the same in other countries.  I think our use of these definitions
 does fall within the context defined here, even if there and a large number of definitions used, as long as the source is cited.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="EmailStyle22"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="EmailStyle22">My opinion, and I am no lawyer.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="EmailStyle22"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="EmailStyle22">Regards, Peter<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">From:
</span></b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">"Margherita.di.Giulio@esa.int" <Margherita.di.Giulio@esa.int><br>
<b>Date: </b>Wednesday, February 5, 2020 at 8:06 AM<br>
<b>To: </b>Tom Gannett <thomas.gannett@tgannett.net><br>
<b>Cc: </b>CCSDS Engineering Steering Group - CESG Exec <cesg@mailman.ccsds.org>, 'CESG' <cesg-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org>, Gian Paolo Calzolari <Gian.Paolo.Calzolari@esa.int>, Howie Weiss <Howard.Weiss@parsons.com>, 'Space Assigned Numbers Authority' <info@sanaregistry.org>,
 Peter Shames <peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [CESG] [Secretariat] [EXTERNAL] Re: CESG Approval of Revised Information Security Glossary<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in">Dear Tom and All, <br>
I will  put one item in the Agenda of the CESG Telecon   - and also of future CCSDS sessions - to recap  the discussion about the SANA Glossary, and its relation with the Glossaries of the CCSDS books.
<br>
Namely: <br>
-        current situation of the SANA Glossary, where terms are derived from normative as well as informative sources
<br>
-        Evolution of the SANA Glossary , having either of the following targets in mind:  
<br>
 o        to clearly identify/distinguish between normative vs. informative terms (depending if e.g. they come from blue or from green books), or
<br>
o        to only leave normative terms in, thus aiming at fully normative role of the Glossary  
<br>
o        other proposals, next steps and roadmap <br>
-        Terms and definitions replicated from copyrighted ISO publications (issue is mainly with the Security Glossary)  for which CCSDS does not (yet) have ISO permission
<br>
<br>
Kind regards,<br>
Margherita <br>
<br>
<span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">--------------------------------------------------------------<br>
</span><b><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#00A1E0">Margherita di Giulio</span></b>
<br>
<span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F">Ground Station Systems Division</span>
<br>
<span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F">Backend Software Section (OPS-GSB)</span>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<b><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F">European Space Agency ESA/ESOC</span></b><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F"><br>
Robert-Bosch-Str. 5<br>
D-64293 Darmstadt - Germany<br>
Tel: +49-6151-902779<br>
e-mail: Margherita.di.Giulio@esa.int</span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F"><br>
<br>
</span><br>
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<span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F">From:        </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">"Thomas Gannett" <thomas.gannett@tgannett.net></span>
<br>
<span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F">To:        </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><Gian.Paolo.Calzolari@esa.int>, "'Shames, Peter M\(US 312B\)'" <peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov></span>
<br>
<span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F">Cc:        </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">"'CCSDS Engineering Steering Group - CESG Exec'" <cesg@mailman.ccsds.org>, "'Space Assigned Numbers Authority'"
 <info@sanaregistry.org>, "'CESG'" <cesg-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org>, "'Weiss, Howard'" <Howard.Weiss@parsons.com></span>
<br>
<span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F">Date:        </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">04/02/2020 18:55</span>
<br>
<span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F">Subject:        </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Re: [CESG] [Secretariat] [EXTERNAL] Re: CESG Approval of Revised Information Security Glossary</span>
<br>
<span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F">Sent by:        </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">"CESG" <cesg-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org></span>
<o:p></o:p></p>
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<o:p> </o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#004080">I think perhaps the term “normative” needs to be defined in the SANA Glossary: Even though the SANA Glossary contains terms derived from normative as well as informative sources, the purpose of having the glossary is to normalize
 the terms within the CCSDS. The Glossary is in fact intended to be “normative” for the CCSDS regardless of the source of the terms: we do adjure all document developers that they should consult it, preferentially use terms defined in it, not arbitrarily redefine
 terms that already exist in it, etc.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#004080"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#004080">Unfortunately, the SANA Glossary is also in a draft state, so discussions of its normative force are academic at the present time.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#004080"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#004080"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#004080">Logothete, L.L.C.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#004080">thomas.gannett@tgannett.net</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#004080">+1 443 472 0805</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#004080"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"> Secretariat [</span><a href="mailto:secretariat-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">mailto:secretariat-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org</span></a><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Gian.Paolo.Calzolari@esa.int<b><br>
Sent:</b> Tuesday, February 04, 2020 5:56 AM<b><br>
To:</b> Shames, Peter M(US 312B)<b><br>
Cc:</b> Weiss, Howard; CCSDS Engineering Steering Group - CESG Exec; Space Assigned Numbers Authority; CESG<b><br>
Subject:</b> Re: [Secretariat] [CESG] [EXTERNAL] Re: CESG Approval of Revised Information Security Glossary</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">There is an additional case: terms defined in an informative annex of a Blue Book.   :o)</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
<br>
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><br>
Regards</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
<br>
</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><br>
Gian Paolo</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
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From:        </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">"Shames, Peter M\(US 312B\) via CESG" <cesg@mailman.ccsds.org></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
</span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F"><br>
To:        </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">"Weiss, Howard" <Howard.Weiss@parsons.com>, "Barkley, Erik J (US 3970)" <erik.j.barkley@jpl.nasa.gov>, "Jonathan Wilmot" <Jonathan.J.Wilmot@NASA.gov></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
</span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F"><br>
Cc:        </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">"Space Assigned Numbers Authority" <info@sanaregistry.org>, "CCSDS Engineering Steering Group - CESG Exec" <cesg@mailman.ccsds.org></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
</span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F"><br>
Date:        </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">03-02-20 20:45</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
</span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F"><br>
Subject:        </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Re: [CESG] [EXTERNAL] Re: CESG Approval of Revised Information Security Glossary</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
</span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#5F5F5F"><br>
Sent by:        </span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">"CESG" <cesg-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org></span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
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I would say that's a "qualified yes".  The normative documents in CCSDS are Blue and Magenta, and so the documents are authoritative.  The Glossary only contains terms that are published in CCSDS documents and it includes the references to those source documents.<o:p></o:p></p>
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The "qualified" part is that there are terms in the Glossary that were were pulled in from Green Books.  As such these are not normative.  So as long as you stick with terms from normative documents I think you are on safe ground.<o:p></o:p></p>
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 <o:p></o:p></p>
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Thanks, Peter<o:p></o:p></p>
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<b><span style="font-size:12.0pt">From: </span></b><span style="font-size:12.0pt">Howie Weiss <Howard.Weiss@parsons.com><b><br>
Date: </b>Monday, February 3, 2020 at 11:28 AM<b><br>
To: </b>Peter Shames <peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov>, Erik Barkley <erik.j.barkley@jpl.nasa.gov>, "Wilmot, Jonathan J. (GSFC-5820)" <Jonathan.J.Wilmot@NASA.gov><b><br>
Cc: </b>CCSDS Engineering Steering Group - CESG Exec <cesg@mailman.ccsds.org>, Space Assigned Numbers Authority <info@sanaregistry.org>, CCSDS Secretariat <secretariat@mailman.ccsds.org><b><br>
Subject: </b>[EXTERNAL] Re: CESG Approval of Revised Information Security Glossary</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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Peter <br>
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Question - in its current state, can a CCSDS document use the SANA glossary as a normative reference?  
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 <br>
howie <br>
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<b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">HOWARD WEISS, </span>
</b><b><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">CISSP</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif"><br>
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</span></u><a href="www.parsons.com"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif">www.parsons.com</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
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Please consider the environment before printing this message</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<b>From:</b> Shames, Peter M (US 312B) <peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov><b><br>
Sent:</b> Monday, February 3, 2020 1:15 PM<b><br>
To:</b> Barkley, Erik J (US 3970); Weiss, Howard; Jonathan Wilmot<b><br>
Cc:</b> CCSDS Engineering Steering Group - CESG Exec; Space Assigned Numbers Authority; CCSDS Secretariat<b><br>
Subject:</b> [EXTERNAL] Re: CESG Approval of Revised Information Security Glossary<span style="color:#2F2F2F">
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">Guys,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">Once this document is approved those terms will be entered into / updated in the SANA Terminology registry.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">That is the process and has been for years.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">Thanks, Peter</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<b><span style="font-size:12.0pt">From: </span></b><span style="font-size:12.0pt">Erik Barkley <erik.j.barkley@jpl.nasa.gov><b><br>
Date: </b>Monday, February 3, 2020 at 10:07 AM<b><br>
To: </b>Howie Weiss <Howard.Weiss@parsons.com>, "Wilmot, Jonathan J. (GSFC-5820)" <Jonathan.J.Wilmot@NASA.gov><b><br>
Cc: </b>Peter Shames <peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov><b><br>
Subject: </b>RE: CESG Approval of Revised Information Security Glossary</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Georgia",serif;color:#004080">Howie,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Georgia",serif;color:#004080">Glad to hear you agree with getting the terms into SANA. With regard to getting “it” into SANA (existing glossary and/or security terms glossary – “it” was not quite clear to me but I
 assume security terms) I think that is something best initiated under the cognizance of the SE Area.  I’ll be happy to “second” any motion if need be, but I think the origin for any such request has to be with the SE Area. I am copying Peter on this email.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Georgia",serif;color:#004080">Best regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Georgia",serif;color:#004080">-Erik </span>
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<b><span style="color:#2F2F2F">From:</span></b><span style="color:#2F2F2F"> Weiss, Howard <Howard.Weiss@parsons.com>
<b><br>
Sent:</b> Friday, January 31, 2020 10:25<b><br>
To:</b> Jonathan Wilmot <Jonathan.J.Wilmot@NASA.gov>; Barkley, Erik J (US 3970) <erik.j.barkley@jpl.nasa.gov><b><br>
Subject:</b> [EXTERNAL] FW: CESG Approval of Revised Information Security Glossary</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">Erik and Jonathan</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">I just saw your comments regarding the Information Security Glossary and I couldn’t agree with you more.  </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">It has always been our plan that the glossary move into SANA.  Others have voiced the same opinion.  However, there has been no movement.  I’ve heard that the existing glossary found on the SANA web site required the first attention
 since its not been reviewed or revised.  Maybe you guys can initiate some movement to get it into SANA?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">Regards</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">howie</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">----------</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<b><span style="font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book",sans-serif;color:#2F2F2F"> </span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
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<b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book",sans-serif;color:#2F2F2F">HOWARD WEISS</span></b><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book",sans-serif;color:#2F2F2F">,
</span></b><b><span style="font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book",sans-serif;color:#2F2F2F">CISSP</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
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<img border="0" width="250" height="55" style="width:2.6041in;height:.5729in" id="_x0000_i1026" src="cid:image001.png@01D5DC01.57E57070"><o:p></o:p></p>
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<b><span style="color:#2F2F2F">From:</span></b><span style="color:#2F2F2F"> SEA-SEC <</span><a href="mailto:sea-sec-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org"><span style="color:#0082BF">sea-sec-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org</span></a><span style="color:#2F2F2F">>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Weiss, Howard<b><br>
Sent:</b> Friday, January 31, 2020 1:19 PM<b><br>
To:</b> 'sea-sec@mailman.ccsds.org' <</span><a href="mailto:sea-sec@mailman.ccsds.org"><span style="color:#0082BF">sea-sec@mailman.ccsds.org</span></a><span style="color:#2F2F2F">><b><br>
Subject:</b> [EXTERNAL] [Sea-sec] CESG Approval of Revised Information Security Glossary</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">FYI - The CESG has approved the revised Information Security Glossary:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * </span>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">CESG E-Poll Identifier:  CESG-P-2019-12-004 Approval to publish CCSDS 350.8-M-2, Information Security Glossary of Terms (Magenta Book, Issue 2) Results of CESG poll beginning 31 December 2019 and ending 29 January 2020:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">               Abstain:  0 (0%) </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">Approve Unconditionally:  6 (100%) (Barkley, Merri, Shames, Burleigh, Moury, Wilmot)
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">Approve with Conditions:  0 (0%) </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">Disapprove with Comment:  0 (0%)</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">CONDITIONS/COMMENTS:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">     Erik Barkley (Approve Unconditionally):  A comment/question (not a condition):  Seems like it would make sense to have this in SANA rather than a book -- has that been considered? In terms of normative application the MB could
 still be normative in identifying SANA registry and the update/governance policy.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">     Jonathan Wilmot (Approve</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">Unconditionally):  I agree with Eric that glossaries would be better in SANA as they are living documents that will change over time.  Example: where would terms from BPsec be placed?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">Total Respondents:  6</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">All Areas responded to this question.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">SECRETARIAT INTERPRETATION OF RESULTS:  Approved Unconditionally</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">PROPOSED SECRETARIAT ACTION:            Generate CMC poll</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<span style="color:#2F2F2F">----------</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book",sans-serif;color:#2F2F2F">HOWARD WEISS</span></b><b><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Franklin Gothic Book",sans-serif;color:#2F2F2F">,
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<pre style="margin-left:.5in">This message is intended only for the recipient(s) named above. It may contain proprietary information and/or<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre style="margin-left:.5in">protected content. Any unauthorised disclosure, use, retention or dissemination is prohibited. If you have received<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre style="margin-left:.5in">this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately. ESA applies appropriate organisational measures to protect<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre style="margin-left:.5in">personal data, in case of data privacy queries, please contact the ESA Data Protection Officer (dpo@esa.int).<o:p></o:p></pre>
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