<font size=2 face="sans-serif">Peter,</font>
<br><font size=2 face="sans-serif"> please
refer to the SLP Report at </font><a href=https://tinyurl.com/yb4lcpzc><font size=2 color=#0082bf face="Calibri"><b><u>https://tinyurl.com/yb4lcpzc</u></b></font></a><font size=2 face="sans-serif">
stating</font>
<br><font size=3 face="Times New Roman">End point Application to Application
Namespace formulations will be discussed at the Spring 2018 meeting as
an additional topic wrt how this content could appear in a managed or signaled
Space Packet Secondary Header (i.e., this work is not part of the project
going to be submitted to CMC approval).</font><font size=3 face="-webkit-standard">
</font>
<br>
<br><font size=2 face="sans-serif">Regards</font>
<br>
<br><font size=2 face="sans-serif">Gian Paolo</font>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif">From:
</font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">"Shames, Peter
M (312B)" <peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov></font>
<br><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif">To:
</font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">"Gian.Paolo.Calzolari@esa.int"
<Gian.Paolo.Calzolari@esa.int></font>
<br><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif">Cc:
</font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">CCSDS CESG -- <cesg@mailman.ccsds.org></font>
<br><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif">Date:
</font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">27/11/2017 18:06</font>
<br><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif">Subject:
</font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">Re: [CESG] Additional
presentation to CMC for extra items // SPP delays?</font>
<br>
<hr noshade>
<br>
<br>
<br><font size=2 face="Calibri">Gippo,</font>
<br><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font>
<br><font size=2 face="Calibri">I do understand the one simple clean-up
project, two books. I was the one who pointed out that the GB also
needed fixing.</font>
<br><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font>
<br><font size=2 face="Calibri">What I was referring to was the second
topic discussed in reference to 133.0-B, the topic of extensions to the
packet secondary header that you explicitly asked to separate from the
"clean up".</font>
<br><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font>
<br><font size=2 face="Calibri">This was what I asked about.</font>
<br><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font>
<br><font size=2 face="Calibri">Regards, Peter</font>
<br><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font>
<br><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font>
<br><font size=3 face="Calibri"><b>From: </b>Gian Paolo Calzolari <Gian.Paolo.Calzolari@esa.int><b><br>
Date: </b>Monday, November 27, 2017 at 8:21 AM<b><br>
To: </b>Peter Shames <peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov><b><br>
Cc: </b>CCSDS Engineering Steering Group - CESG Exec <cesg@mailman.ccsds.org><b><br>
Subject: </b>Re: [CESG] Additional presentation to CMC for extra items
// SPP delays?</font>
<br><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font>
<br><font size=2 face="sans-serif">Peter,</font><font size=2 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
there are not two separate projects against
one document. The two projects re on different books: 133.0-B and 130.0-G
respectively.</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> <br>
</font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
If you refer to the fact that sometimes in the future 130.0-G Overview
of Space Communications Protocols may need further modification this will
be tackled as required (e.g project modification or new project if the
old one is finished or something else...) when such need will materialise..</font><font size=2 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
Note that starting the two project concurrently has been explicitly requested
by SLP.</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> <br>
</font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
I hope this addresses your remarks</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> <br>
</font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
Regards</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> <br>
</font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
Gippo</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> <br>
<br>
<br>
</font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
From: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">"Shames,
Peter M (312B)" <peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov></font><font size=2 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
To: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">"Gian.Paolo.Calzolari@esa.int"
<Gian.Paolo.Calzolari@esa.int></font><font size=2 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
Cc: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">CCSDS
CESG -- <cesg@mailman.ccsds.org></font><font size=2 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
Date: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">27/11/2017
17:05</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
Subject: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">Re:
[CESG] Additional presentation to CMC for extra items // SPP delays?</font><font size=2 face="Calibri">
</font>
<div align=center>
<hr noshade></div>
<br><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
Hi Gippo,</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
Thanks for processing this request to make the limited set of changes to
the SPP and OSCP docs. They are really over-due and I am glad to
see the plan to make these repairs being put into motion.</font><font size=2 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
I do not think that the second project is in progress yet. And I
still question the logic of creating two separate projects against one
document. How do you think this is going to be handled? Two
separate versions of the same document? Two separate agency reviews
for the same document? Is there going to be an enforced delay in
publishing the second version with the second set of updates in order to
maintain document stability?</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
Just what do you think the plan is to deal with these considerations?</font><font size=2 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
Regards, Peter</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=3 face="Calibri"><b><br>
From: </b>Gian Paolo Calzolari <Gian.Paolo.Calzolari@esa.int><b><br>
Date: </b>Wednesday, November 22, 2017 at 2:41 AM<b><br>
To: </b>Peter Shames <peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov><b><br>
Cc: </b>CCSDS Engineering Steering Group - CESG Exec <cesg@mailman.ccsds.org><b><br>
Subject: </b>Re: [CESG] Additional presentation to CMC for extra items
// SPP delays? </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
Peter,</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
thanks to the excellent cooperation by Greg Kazz
(but not only) the SLS-SLP request to start two projects (instead of one
as originally planned in The Hague) is out for starting CMC Poll less than
two weeks after the The Hague Meetings.</font><font size=2 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
<br>
I think we all shall be happy for this timely achievement.</font><font size=2 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
<br>
Regards</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
<br>
Gippo</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> <br>
<br>
</font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
<br>
From: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">Gian.Paolo.Calzolari@esa.int</font><font size=2 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
To: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">"Shames,
Peter M (312B)" <peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov></font><font size=2 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
Cc: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">"CESG
-- CCSDS-Engineering SteeringGroup\(cesg@mailman.ccsds.org\)\(cesg@mailman.ccsds.org\)"
<cesg@mailman.ccsds.org></font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
Date: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">13/11/2017
12:07</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
Subject: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">Re:
[CESG] Additional presentation to CMC for extra items // SPP
delays?</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
Sent by: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">"CESG"
<cesg-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org></font><font size=2 face="Calibri">
</font>
<div align=center>
<hr noshade></div>
<br><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
</font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
<br>
[attachment "ConceptPaper-uplink coding_green_V2(cleanFinal).pdf"
deleted by Gian Paolo Calzolari/esoc/ESA] <br>
<br>
Peter, <br>
it looks as you were not there when I clearly told
Greg that "despite not strictly needed for updating of documents,
you may want to prepare a concept paper to support the SLS resolution as
it is much simpler editing in word that putting dates in CWE".</font><font size=3 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
<br>
The Concept Paper we refer to is like the attached one (BTW, done by JPL
guys) and contains the information to be relied anyhow to CMC to allow
them to approve the new project. <br>
<br>
If you think that providing this kind of information (normally 1
page of text and 1 or 2 pages for project definition) is provoking big
delays, I will have to live with this.</font><font size=3 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
<br>
Regards</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
<br>
Gian Paolo</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> <br>
</font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
<br>
<br>
From: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">"Shames,
Peter M (312B)" <peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov></font><font size=3 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
To: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">"Gian.Paolo.Calzolari@esa.int"
<Gian.Paolo.Calzolari@esa.int></font><font size=3 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
Cc: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">"Nestor.Peccia@esa.int"
<Nestor.Peccia@esa.int>, "CESG -- CCSDS-Engineering SteeringGroup(cesg@mailman.ccsds.org)(cesg@mailman.ccsds.org)"
<cesg@mailman.ccsds.org></font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
Date: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">13/11/2017
01:09</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=1 color=#5f5f5f face="sans-serif"><br>
Subject: </font><font size=1 face="sans-serif">Re:
[CESG] Additional presentation to CMC for extra items</font><font size=3 face="Calibri">
</font>
<div align=center>
<hr noshade></div>
<br><font size=3 face="Calibri"><br>
</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
<br>
Gippo,</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
I know that these issues were raised prior to the WG and that both of them
were discussed within the meetings. Ken Andrews gave a presentation
on the coding issue and Greg Kazz gave a presentation on the SPP which
you, I, Jonathan, and Scott were all present for.</font><font size=3 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
Given this situation, and the very straightforward fact that text was left
out of a revised document without any explanation, I do not think that
what I have stated is in any way unilateral. In fact, it seems to
me that it is you who are unilaterally throwing roadblocks in the way of
forward progress in both of these cases.</font><font size=3 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
Regards, Peter</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> <br>
<b><br>
<br>
From: </b>Gian Paolo Calzolari <Gian.Paolo.Calzolari@esa.int><b><br>
Date: </b>Sunday, November 12, 2017 at 1:15 PM<b><br>
To: </b>Peter Shames <peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov><b><br>
Cc: </b>Nestor Peccia <Nestor.Peccia@esa.int>, CCSDS Engineering
Steering Group - CESG Exec <cesg@mailman.ccsds.org><b><br>
Subject: </b>Re: [CESG] Additional presentation to CMC for extra items
</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
Peter. <br>
Your points look as something that should have been discussed in
WGs (were you there?)</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
I do not share your view and I reserve to complain if unilaterally presented
to CMC. <br>
<br>
Ciao</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
Gian Paolo</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
Sent from my iPhone</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
On 12. Nov 2017, at 22:08, Shames, Peter M (312B) <</font><a href=mailto:peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov><font size=2 color=#0082bf face="Calibri"><u>peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov</u></font></a><font size=2 face="Calibri">>
wrote:</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
Hi Nestor,</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
There is no NWI page for the SecWG inputs because they do not yet have
a plan for the work with work level estimates. What they have is
a "plan for a plan". When they get done planning I'll submit
the requests.</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
And on the subject of "things causing delays to projects", I
would point out that the CESG approval cycle for draft and "proposed
for publication" document is not the only place where delays are introduced.
It's just the one where there are currently issues being voiced.
I have also given voice to the sorts of delays that have recently
been introduced in the SPP and the AOS coding topics where work is being
started, or errors are being fixed. These were not included in the
materials you prepared, but they are very real sources of delays and thus
should also be addressed.</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
SPP</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
In the case of SPP, even though there was a meeting that arrived
at consensus on the need and the topics to be covered, involving people
from three SLS working groups, and the SIS, SOIS and SEA areas, there was
an added request to create a white paper prior to starting the project
in the WG. This is certainly covered by the procedures, but it is
usually invoked when there is a totally new, and not well understood, topic
being introduced. In this case the work is quite well understood
and the delay somewhat uncalled for. Just as you have "streamlined"
some of the CESG voting procedures to avoid delays the same thing could
have been done in this case.</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
AOS coding</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
In the case of the AOS coding for uplink there is a clear and documented
situation where the topic of using TM coding for AOS, for uplink and downlink,
were documented in an earlier CCSDS spec, "TM Channel Coding",
CCSDS 101.0-B-6, but got dropped from the current "TM Synch and Channel
Coding" spec, CCSDS <br>
In the original 101.0 document, under Sec 1.3 Applicability, it stated,
very clearly (<b><u>emphasis</u></b> added):</font><font size=3 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=2 color=#0082bf face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
In addition to being applicable to conventional Packet Telemetry systems
[1], <b><u>the codes in this recommendation are applicable to the forward
and return links of Advanced Orbiting Systems (AOS) [2]</u></b>. For coding
purposes, the terms ìTransfer Frameî and ìReed-Solomon Codeblockî as used
in this recommendation are understood to be equivalent to the AOS terms
ìVirtual Channel Data Unitî (VCDU), and ìCoded Virtual Channel Data Unitî
(CVCDU), respectively. </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
For reasons that are totally unexplained in any form that anyone can unearth,
this was modified in the current 131.0, under Sec 1.0 Purpose, to read:</font><font size=3 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=2 color=#0082bf face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
The purpose of this Recommended Standard is to specify synchronization
and channel coding schemes used with the TM Space Data Link Protocol (reference
[1]) or the AOS Space Data Link Protocol (reference [2]). These schemes
are to be used over space-to- ground or space-to-space communications links
by space missions. </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
The consequence of this change, which appears to be both editorial and
wrongly placed, iy should be in Applicability, as before, is to arbitrarily
remove the explicit coverage for AOS uplink from the TM Synch and Channel
Coding book. The only explanation given was "this spec if for
telemetry", therefore it should not be used for forward links. But
in the original 101.0 spec this case was covered, with no apparent issue
being identified. <br>
<br>
The "remedy" proposed for this editorial error is, instead of
just fixing the error, to require that a new "Magenta Book" be
produced. I'll leave out of the discussion that this would actually
need to be a Blue Book, of type "utilization profile". Requiring
that this error be remedied by creation of a new Blue Book appears to be
punitive and will cause expense of resources that could well be invested
otherwise. It also is calling for creation of a new type of document
within SLS, for which there is no precedent. If one were to treat
this request as a new policy on SLS document there would be a whole slew
of new documents required, specifying how to use TC over specific codes,
TM over other codes, etc. This is a waste of time and resources which
could be very easily avoided by simply using a corriegendum to repair the
missing text.</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
So my request is that you either treat all of these sources of delays in
an even handed fashion or that you treat none of them. Furthermore,
if you do decide to include the materials that we discussed I would request
that you explicitly include the points I made during the meeting on the
proximal source of the issue being inadequate quality control at the originating
WG and Area level. All of these issues could have been avoided at
CESG review if the documents had been closer to error free and complete
when submitted.</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Calibri"><br>
<br>
Best regards, Peter</font><font size=3 face="Calibri"> <br>
<br>
<br>
<b><br>
<br>
From: </b>CESG <</font><a href="mailto:cesg-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org"><font size=3 color=#0082bf face="Calibri"><u>cesg-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org</u></font></a><font size=3 face="Calibri">>
on behalf of Nestor Peccia <</font><a href=mailto:Nestor.Peccia@esa.int><font size=3 color=#0082bf face="Calibri"><u>Nestor.Peccia@esa.int</u></font></a><font size=3 face="Calibri">><b><br>
Date: </b>Sunday, November 12, 2017 at 6:33 AM<b><br>
To: </b>CCSDS Engineering Steering Group - CESG Exec <</font><a href=mailto:cesg@mailman.ccsds.org><font size=3 color=#0082bf face="Calibri"><u>cesg@mailman.ccsds.org</u></font></a><font size=3 face="Calibri">><b><br>
Subject: </b>[CESG] Additional presentation to CMC for extra items </font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
<br>
Dear all.</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
<br>
Please find attached the additional presentation to CMC.</font><font size=2 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
<br>
It still miss some inputs from SEA SEC WG for the NWIs.</font><font size=2 face="Calibri">
</font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
<br>
Comments welcome</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
ciao</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="sans-serif"><br>
nestor</font><font size=2 face="Calibri"> </font><font size=2 face="Courier New"><br>
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<br><PRE>This message and any attachments are intended for the use of the addressee or addressees only.
The unauthorised disclosure, use, dissemination or copying (either in whole or in part) of its
content is not permitted.
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Emails can be altered and their integrity cannot be guaranteed by the sender.
Please consider the environment before printing this email.
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