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<div class=""><b class=""><u class="">Just an FYI </u></b>- The CESG-All is moderated, and no outsiders can send an
<b class=""><u class="">immediate</u></b> e-mail to that list. If an outsider attempts to e-mail that list, and is not a member; or has previously not been added to the bypass whitelist (there is only a few addresses…mostly Secretariat staff) for that mailing
list….then their post is held for moderation. I have seen situations where an outsider has attempted to e-mail a mailing list, and also directly CC’s another users e-mail address (who may have been a CESG-All member). That e-mail will be held for moderation,
but the CESG-All member (who received the e-mail directly) may decide “reply to all”, and then users of the mailing list will see that reply. Hope this makes sense….</div>
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<div class="">Anyways, I understand the situation. Sometimes CESG-All is used when CESG would have been the better choice. Either way though, ADs and DADs will be receiving numerous e-mails.</div>
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<div class="">On Jul 22, 2015, at 12:50 PM, Shames, Peter M (312B) <<a href="mailto:peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov" class="">peter.m.shames@jpl.nasa.gov</a>> wrote:</div>
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<title class="">Organization and Processes for the Consultative Committee for Space Data Systems</title>
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<div style="font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">Hi Guys,</div>
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<div style="font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">I agree entirely that this particular situation got out of hand, but I don't think we need more rules or constraints applied to the mailing lists, I just think we need to observe some
reasonable email etiquette. I think that looks like this:</div>
<ol style="font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">
<li class="">Topics that are local (within a WG) should remain local unless there is an issue. Use a WG mailing list or even a targetted list of people until there is a consensus that can be brought to a larger list.</li><li class="">Topics that are area wide will need to be discussed at least with the area exec team, that is the AD & deputy, and WG chairs and their deputies. Both SEA and SOIS have "exec" mailing lists that include these leaders. This should probably be the
practice for all Areas. The CMC does something similar and the "CESG" mailing list is already the "exec" list, by default.</li><li class="">Topics that touch multiple WG in different areas, or multiple areas, can be discussed using a targetted list of people, but many will (eventually) need to be sent to the CESG list. I think the practice of holding dynamic discussions in a smaller
targetted list until concensus is reached is a good one.</li><li class="">I personally believe that the CESG-ALL list should be used, for the most part, for announcements that really affect all the areas and the WGs. Examples might be working meeting changes or changes to policy documents. I do not think that there
are many topics that need to be discussed at the CESG-ALL level, but others may have different opinions or examples.</li></ol>
<div style="font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class="">As for the overall quantity of emails that an CESG member will see, even adhereing to this sort of etiquette, it will be a fair amount. The CESG is supposed to provide the teachnical
leadership for CCSDS and we have been assigned responsibility for keeping not just our Areas, but the whole of the CCSDS, working smoothly and producing quality standards. We can and should do what we can to remove random "noise" from these channels, but
we also have to expect to deal with the breadth of work that CCSDS is engaged in and not just our own corner of it.</div>
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<div class=""><span style="font-size: 12.000000pt; font-family: 'TimesNewRomanPS'; font-weight: 700" class="">2.3.2.1 General (CESG)</span></div>
<div class=""><span style="font-size: 12.000000pt; font-family: 'TimesNewRomanPSMT'" class="">The CCSDS Engineering Steering Group (CESG) is responsible for technical management across CCSDS domains and for the top-level coordination of the overall international
standardization process. It ensures that all developments occur in accordance with procedures, schedules, and resources that have been negotiated with the CMC. </span></div>
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<div class=""><span style="font-size: 12.000000pt; font-family: 'TimesNewRomanPS'; font-weight: 700" class="">2.3.2.3 CESG Responsibilities
</span></div>
<div class=""><span style="font-size: 12.000000pt; font-family: 'TimesNewRomanPSMT'" class="">The CESG is specifically responsible for the following:
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<li class="">
<div class=""><span style="font-size: 12.000000pt; font-family: 'TimesNewRomanPSMT'" class="">a) maintaining and upholding the overall technical quality and consistency of the evolving set of CCSDS Recommended Standards and Practices;
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</li></ol>
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<div class=""><span style="font-size: 12.000000pt; font-family: 'TimesNewRomanPSMT'" class="">b) providing the CCSDS-wide forum where the work programs of the Areas may be coordinated and synchronized in the context of an overall architecture for space- mission
cross support and the needs of individual customers;</span></div>
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<div class="">My suggestion is that we may benefit from taking a little time to re-state what is expected for email etiquette (something like what I provided above), from adding explicit Area-Exec mailing lists where needed tp help with the Area level local
comm, but otherwise not try to control or constrain communications. A certain amount of open dialogue is essential for smooth operation. </div>
<div class="">Regards, Peter</div>
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<span style="font-weight:bold" class="">From: </span><<a href="mailto:cesg-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org" class="">cesg-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org</a>> on behalf of Gian Paolo Calzolari <<a href="mailto:Gian.Paolo.Calzolari@esa.int" class="">Gian.Paolo.Calzolari@esa.int</a>><br class="">
<span style="font-weight:bold" class="">Date: </span>Wednesday, July 22, 2015 at 12:57 AM<br class="">
<span style="font-weight:bold" class="">To: </span>Mario Merri <<a href="mailto:Mario.Merri@esa.int" class="">Mario.Merri@esa.int</a>><br class="">
<span style="font-weight:bold" class="">Cc: </span>CCSDS Engineering Steering Group - CESG Exec <<a href="mailto:cesg@mailman.ccsds.org" class="">cesg@mailman.ccsds.org</a>><br class="">
<span style="font-weight:bold" class="">Subject: </span>[CESG] Re: [Cesg-all] Too many CESG emails (was CFDPv1 status update)<br class="">
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<div class=""><font size="2" face="sans-serif" class="">I do concur with Mario analysis (and I avoided spreading my reply also to the SESG-ALL lis :o) and for discussion at next CESG Webex.</font><br class="">
<font size="2" face="sans-serif" class="">The problem rises from the fact that sometimes replies also include additional cc's and sometimes this extra cc's are other WG's mailing lists.</font><br class="">
<br class="">
<font size="2" face="sans-serif" class="">So the first rule of should be avoiding the reply with additional cc's; i.e. if anybody in the CESG-ALL mailing list (only chairs in principle) consider the topic relevant for discussion in the WG, then (s)he should
rather forward the mail and then report back only the conclusions. Of course this depends on personal behavior and cannot be prevented automatically but relies on auto discipline.</font><br class="">
<br class="">
<font size="2" face="sans-serif" class="">The second rule could be implemented by CCSDS Tech Support by setting the CESG-ALL mailing list to reject mails from non members.</font><br class="">
<font size="2" face="sans-serif" class="">As I think that the flood of mails mentioned by Mario did also include mails from non member (i.e. non chairpersons) I fear this setting is not implemented.</font><br class="">
<br class="">
<font size="2" face="sans-serif" class="">Best regards</font> <br class="">
<br class="">
<font size="2" face="sans-serif" class="">Gian Paolo</font> <br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<font size="1" color="#5f5f5f" face="sans-serif" class="">From: </font><font size="1" face="sans-serif" class=""><a href="mailto:Mario.Merri@esa.int" class="">Mario.Merri@esa.int</a></font><br class="">
<font size="1" color="#5f5f5f" face="sans-serif" class="">To: </font><font size="1" face="sans-serif" class=""><a href="mailto:Nestor.Peccia@esa.int" class="">Nestor.Peccia@esa.int</a>,
</font><br class="">
<font size="1" color="#5f5f5f" face="sans-serif" class="">Cc: </font><font size="1" face="sans-serif" class=""><a href="mailto:cesg-all@mailman.ccsds.org" class="">cesg-all@mailman.ccsds.org</a></font><br class="">
<font size="1" color="#5f5f5f" face="sans-serif" class="">Date: </font><font size="1" face="sans-serif" class="">22/07/2015 09:36</font><br class="">
<font size="1" color="#5f5f5f" face="sans-serif" class="">Subject: </font><font size="1" face="sans-serif" class="">[Cesg-all] Too many CESG emails (was CFDPv1 status update)</font><br class="">
<font size="1" color="#5f5f5f" face="sans-serif" class="">Sent by: </font><font size="1" face="sans-serif" class=""><a href="mailto:cesg-all-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org" class="">cesg-all-bounces@mailman.ccsds.org</a></font><br class="">
<hr noshade="" class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
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<tt class=""><font size="2" class="">Dear Nestor,<br class="">
<br class="">
I do not know if the same is true for the others in the CESG-ALL distribution<br class="">
list, but I have serious problems in handling the high rate of emails on this<br class="">
(and other) channel.<br class="">
<br class="">
As an example, the thread "CFDPv1 status update" resulted in more than 10<br class="">
emails that were distributed to a large distribution list. I am not claiming<br class="">
that the topic was not of interest, I just cannot afford to follow all<br class="">
possible topics with the same intensity.<br class="">
<br class="">
I believe we should define a rule or code of conduct to manage these<br class="">
situations. One possibility could be that as soon as it is understood that<br class="">
the topic cannot be resolved within a couple of emails, then the discussion<br class="">
continues in a restricted group and the conclusions reported at the end to<br class="">
CESG-ALL. Other options are clearly possible.<br class="">
<br class="">
I suggest this issue is discussed at the next CESG webEx.<br class="">
<br class="">
Regards,<br class="">
<br class="">
__Mario<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
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</span></div>
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CESG mailing list<br class="">
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http://mailman.ccsds.org/mailman/listinfo/cesg<br class="">
_______________________________________________<br class="">
Secretariat mailing list<br class="">
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